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<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
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<p>(Apologies to Zele descendants as this applies to the Rogelj
line. We have even less to go on with the origins of Zele!)<br>
ref: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://mycuz.us/gen/tree/Main/family/F464/John-Rogelj-Maria-Udovich">https://mycuz.us/gen/tree/Main/family/F464/John-Rogelj-Maria-Udovich</a><br>
</p>
<p>Family.</p>
<p>A step closer to finding Anna Rogelj's home area in Slovenia?
Now just need to visit Slovenia and dig into the church records
with this new theory as a first start.<br>
</p>
<p>I have not worked much on the Rogelj line over the past few
years. In fact, Mary Ellen Capser has gone silent. She is the
cousin in Montana that we so strongly DNA matched with way back in
2016. (She has a notice in the local paper from June 2020 thanking
the high school kids who helped her after a fall. So she is still
around.) Another even more distant DNA match and I are trying to
figure out the connection though (Margaret Srebrnjak). And think
it is through Maria Udovich; the Rogelj sisters mother (maiden
name). <br>
</p>
<p>Margaret pointed me to the minimal surviving 1869 Slovenia
census. It covers Ljubljana and Trebnje and little else. Minimal
so could simply be a confirmation by lack of other conflicting
information and as opposed to an exhaustive search.</p>
<p>From the below of two years ago, I was talking about looking for
Rogelj in the <span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška Vas villages.
The 1869 census has Dolenja </span><span style="color: rgb(34,
34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">Nemška Vas fully numerated (16 houses then). House 15
has a Vdovč </span>family which is believed an old line form of
Udovich in America. In two nearby villages, there are a "boat
load" of Rogelj's (Rihpovec and Repče). With one in the even
closer village of Češnjevek.<br>
<br>
We do not have exact birth dates for Johan Rogelj (who came to
America) nor Maria Udovich (who died in Slovenia; we presume).
But the current indication is 1850 to 1860. It is about 1854 if
we are to believe John's ship arrival record in 1899 with daughter
Josephine in tow where He says they are going to son-in-law Joseph
Kosak in Cleveland. John and daughter Josephine are then in
Montana shortly after with Josephine marrying a Martin Gliko.
Believed brother to Johanna Gliko who traveled with Mary and Anna
Rogelj the year before.<br>
</p>
<p>Češnjevek House #5 has a Rogelj family with a Jozef Rogelj born
in 1854. We have one record which lists his name as Jozef. Hmm.
Looking at a modern day google map, they even identify today a
business in a home in Češnjevek as belonging to Alojz Rogelj.<br>
</p>
<p>So a current theory is maybe the kids (Anna, Josephine, etc) were
staying at the mothers ancestral home in Dolenja <span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"></span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška Vas before
emigrating. Possibly because the father had left for America
for work and money. And left the kids with the in-laws because
his wife had passed by then. Or maybe left for work because
they were destitute and the mother took the kids to her parents
home. Key is, we will look in church records covering these
villages as a starting point.</span></p>
<p><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">1869 Census records:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.sistory.si/cdn/publikacije/23001-24000/23035/NME_Trebnje_1869_Dolenja_Nemska_vas_15.pdf">https://www.sistory.si/cdn/publikacije/23001-24000/23035/NME_Trebnje_1869_Dolenja_Nemska_vas_15.pdf</a>
Udovich family (but no Maria)<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.sistory.si/IGNORED_PUBLIC/popisi/12/NME_Trebnje_1869_Cesnjevek_5_002.jpg"><br>
https://www.sistory.si/IGNORED_PUBLIC/popisi/12/NME_Trebnje_1869_Cesnjevek_5_002.jpg</a>
Josef Rogelj b1854 in </span><br>
<span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color:
rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Cesnjevek 5 (village / road
next door to </span></span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34,
34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">Dolenja </span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;"><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška Vas</span>)</span></p>
<p><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><img
src="cid:part4.D3B105F0.FDF2E629@mycuz.us" alt="" width="826"
height="365"></span></p>
<p><img src="cid:part5.753C49C8.C63A5ED9@mycuz.us" width="828"
height="590" border="0"><br>
<span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"></span></p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">All Rogelj's in Trebnje area census
from 1869 that are born around 1855:<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.sistory.si/popis/napredno-iskanje/?id_popis=12&ime=&priimek=Rogelj&leto_rojstva=1855&ulica=&st_ulice=&start=0">https://www.sistory.si/popis/napredno-iskanje/?id_popis=12&ime=&priimek=Rogelj&leto_rojstva=1855&ulica=&st_ulice=&start=0</a></div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">We mentioned that Johanna Glika
traveled with the Rogelj sisters. And Josefine Rogelj later
traveled with her father and soon after married a Martin Glika.
There are no Glika's in Slovenia but there are Gliha's. In fact,
a family in the neighboring village of Dolenji Podboršt pri Treb
in house 3. This is the southern border to Dolenja <span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška Vas. So need to</span>
look more into Josephine's in-laws as well.</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">All Gliha's in Trebnje area census from
1869:</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.sistory.si/popis/napredno-iskanje/?id_popis=12&ime=&priimek=Gliha&leto_rojstva=&ulica=&st_ulice=&start=0">https://www.sistory.si/popis/napredno-iskanje/?id_popis=12&ime=&priimek=Gliha&leto_rojstva=&ulica=&st_ulice=&start=0</a><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">The other family listed at "Slive of RIb 2" is
actually Kriska Reber which is a few miles north, northwest of
Trebnje.</span></div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255,
255); text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;"><br>
</span></div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/25/2018 2:35 PM, Randy Harr wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:3228bf50-cfc9-c1c8-484d-748c18f2f547@mycuz.us">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<p>(Apologies to Zele descendants as this applies to the Rogelj
line. We have even less to go on with the origins of Zele!)</p>
<p>Ref: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://gen.mycuz.us/family.php?famid=F464"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://gen.mycuz.us/family.php?famid=F464</a><br>
</p>
<p>Cousins,</p>
<p>There have been many false starts in trying to figure out the
Rogelj's origination in Slovenia. With the recent success of
the Kosak line and the find of a new site mapire.eu, I wanted to
recollect my thoughts on the Rogelj line. Just in case the
Rogelj's could have come from the same village as the Kosaks.
Below is me documenting everything I have to date. Have as yet
to hear if Mary Ellen, our 2nd cousin on the Rogelj side in
Montana, has anything more to refine this information.<br>
</p>
<p>My current best guess as to the village for the Rogelj's is one
of the Nemska vas villages very near Trebnje. They were
historically known as Deutschdorf or literally "german
village". Need to now find a parish name for that time covering
each village in order to initiate the record search process in
Slovenia.<br>
</p>
<p>One key thing is I think we can rule out the Slovenska Vas name
I had been going with since some interaction with Charles Rougle
a number of years ago. Partly because of the lack of a DNA
match there but also because our lines really do appear
different. It was, in essence, a false lead.<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-forward-container">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8">
<p><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Randy<br>
</span></p>
<p><b><font size="+2"><u><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">Details</span></u></font></b><br>
</p>
<p>As a reminder, my Rogelj records indicate the original
village as:<br>
</p>
<ul>
<li> Rudolfswert (Novo Mesto) from Maria and Anna's passenger
list (Mary Jeric nee Rogelj, Anna Kosak nee Rogelj)</li>
<li> Deutschdorf for father John and sister Josephine's
passenger list (Josephine Frost nee Gliko nee Rogelj)</li>
<li> Trebnje for brother John passenger list and
naturalization paper (95% sure this is the correct John)<br>
</li>
</ul>
<p>Various possibilities of the original village using this
information are (using current names):</p>
<ol>
<li>Gorenja <span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas, Trebnje (on
1890 map as Oberdeutschdorf) (upper, west side)</span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"></span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"></span></li>
<li><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Dolenja </span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas, Trebnje (on
1890 map as Unterdeutschdorf) (lower, east side)</span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"></span></li>
<li><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas na Blokah,
Nova Vas (Nova Vas was formerly Neudorf)</span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"></span></li>
<li><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas, Ribnica (one
shown on clip earlier; near Nova Vas)</span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"></span></li>
<li><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas, Leskovec pri
Kr</span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures:
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">škem (west of Kr</span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color:
rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;"></span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">š</span>ko)</span></li>
</ol>
<p>Ends up there are a number of Deutschdorf's on the mapire.eu
1890's map as has been indicated before in various sources.
So still not clear which is the correct one. They have not
digitized the name Deutchsdorf to search by. The "search"
feature on mapire.eu is actually using openmaps of today. So I
searched for <span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas which was listed
along with the german Deutschdor as the name in the 1890
maps. (I also searched Slovenska vas for historical
reasons.)</span></p>
<ol>
</ol>
<p><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Slovenska Vas near
Sentrupert is listed in Wikipedia and other places as
formerly </span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34);
font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color: rgb(34,
34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color:
rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">Nemška vas and formerly Deutschdorf</span></span>.
But this is only identified on the 1890 map </span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">as Schl.
Watzenberg (Castle?). So must have been the name changed to
and added much later? The other main Slovenska vas is on the
Croatian border near Zagreb and is named Breganskoselo in
the old map. The other two Slovenska vas are not labeled
Deutschdorf either in the 1890 old map either. The only
time I find Deutschdorf on the old map is in association
with the Slovenian name </span><span style="color: rgb(34,
34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color: rgb(34,
34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;"><span style="color:
rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size:
14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
text-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color:
initial;">Nemška vas (on corresponding old and new maps)</span></span></span>.
(BTW, I do confirm on this 1890 map that Rudolfswert is Novo
Mesto.) So am not considering Slovenska vas any more.<br>
</p>
<p>So, in trying to determine further which of these villages is
possible:<br>
</p>
<ul>
<li> Options (1) & (2) <span style="color: rgb(34, 34,
34); font-family: sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Gorenja and Dolenja </span><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas </span>fits
best for brother John who says he is from Trebnje</li>
<li> Options (1) & (2) are closest to Rudolfswert / Novo
Mesto which is indicated by sisters Maria and Anna (and
confirmed on the 1890 map). Options (3) & (4) are
pretty distant from Novo Mesto as is (5) -- other major
municipalities from 1890 are much closer.<br>
</li>
</ul>
<p> So guess this is all pointing to (1) / (2) <span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"><span
style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400;
letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255,
255, 255); text-decoration-style: initial;
text-decoration-color: initial;">Gorenja or </span>Dolenja
</span><span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family:
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Nemška vas </span>as
likely. <br>
</p>
<p>But why would sisters list Novo Mesto given Trebnje has been
a municipality on its own all along? Trebnje not big enough?<br>
</p>
<p>Here is a map showing all the various points:</p>
<p><img src="cid:part9.8F67269B.FBF6C7FE@mycuz.us" alt=""
class="" width="884" height="413"></p>
<p>So from <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://mapire.eu/en/synchron/thirdsurvey75000/"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://mapire.eu/en/synchron/thirdsurvey75000/</a>
, I show (2) above as an example:<br>
</p>
<p><img src="cid:part11.3B2F5134.341DDC8C@mycuz.us" alt=""
class="" width="863" height="983"></p>
<span style="color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: sans-serif;
font-size: 14px; font-variant-ligatures: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing:
normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;"></span><br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/5/2018 10:35 AM, Randy Harr
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:08bd3dd3-5223-6db7-578c-eac6151199a3@mycuz.us">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8">
....
<p>Here is my Rogelj info.</p>
<p><font size="+2"><b><font color="#ff0000">Sisters Maria and
Anna departure from Hamburg, 10 May 1898. Say from
Rudolfswert which I take to be Novo Mesto.</font></b></font><br>
</p>
<p><img src="cid:part12.80F19BDB.5F31D613@mycuz.us" alt=""
class=""><br>
<font size="+2" color="#ff0000"><b>Father and sister John's
arrival at Ellis Island, 17 Oct 1899 from Deutschdor
which I take to be Slovenska Vas (but which one?) <font
color="#008000">[UPDATE: now known to be Nemška Vas]</font>:</b></font><img
src="cid:part13.8D0EA152.55FD9D2C@mycuz.us" alt=""
class=""><br>
</p>
<p>Notice it says the father came before in 1898/90. Cannot
make out where it says he was then though it appears maybe
XXX, Minnesota. He is in the 1900 census in Helena, Montana
working in a smelter.<br>
</p>
<p><font size="+2" color="#ff0000"><b>Brother John's
Naturalization which lists Trebnje as birth location:</b></font><br>
</p>
<p><img src="cid:part14.11DD7968.3FA6DE06@mycuz.us" alt=""
class=""></p>
<p>Think this was correct based on the father's name, wifes
name and witness is brother in law Joseph Jeric. But not
100% like the others. Many John's married Mary's.<br>
</p>
<p><img src="cid:part15.F13204C0.C9B886C3@mycuz.us" alt=""
class=""></p>
<p>Recall that I mentioned before that Petra went off and
researched the name / line. Rogelj is near like Smith or
Hrovath. Pretty dominate. John Rogelj is even worse.
There are many of the same age and in Cleveland and Montana
-- where my John was. And they are all going back and forth
it seems. For example, there is our John Rogelj born 15
June 1891 and a John Rogel born 25 June 1891 and living in
Summit, Ohio (outside Cleveland). We have only started to
distinguish lines via autosomal testing of descendants. So
not worth anyone looking in American records further (at
this time). I am still searching for a possible
Naturalization record for Josephine Frost nee Gliko nee
Rogelj or her husband.<br>
</p>
<p><font size="+1" color="#ff0000"><b>In pulling this
together, I just noticed that a Johann Glicka traveled
with Maria and Anna. Their sister Josephine, who came a
year later with the dad, married a Martin Gliko shortly
after arriving. It says Johann was going to Cleveland.
This may be the connection for Josephine.</b></font><br>
</p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
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